forum.sports-pro.co.uk

Death n Taxes · Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 11:17 am Post subject: Breeders cup betting guide

i think this merits its own thread.

Could someone do a summary of the betting options in the states. in particular what is the difference between show and place and what is the morning line price. It seems we will be able to bet into us pools via betfair so i am interested to know more about the best way to lose my money.

Cheers
_________________
There are two certainties in life Death and Taxes they no longer tax betting so there may be a god

Grand National 2009 Comp Winner
September October 2009 NAP Comp Winner

Gorg_George · Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:34 pm Post subject: Re: Breeders cup betting guide

newyorktony · Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:46 pm Post subject:

http://www.ultimatecapper.com/how-to-bet-on-horses.htm

this should help you out

cre8flow · Group Performer Joined: 28 Mar 2006 Posts: 1921

most often the morning line is irrelevant in the states
the pick 3 bet is okay for the breeders cup and other big days in the states
always important to know the pool size-here for the bc its fine
the pick 4 is a bet that has lost some of its value but its still pretty decent play
still you have to be right all 4 races
but it can be a huge payout when all the favs lose-as much as 6 figures but this only happens a few times a year
a superfecta or trifecta is probably perferable as you only have to be correct in 1 race
plus in the states you can bet dime supers-ten cents-this has decreased the value of the bet
the tri is getting the first 3 in order
the superfecta is getting the first 4 horses in a row
the pentafecta is somewhat new and is a reaction to the installation of the dime bet-it is the first 5 in the same race and is only in the last race-professionals do not like the dime bet as they are able to overwhelm the pool with massive bets
say a 6 horse $1 superfecta box which costs $720
a 5 horse superfecta box costs $120
a 4 horse superbox is $24
a .10 superbox costs $2.40-the box covers all combinations of the horses you are betting
a trifecta wheel is keying 1 horse on top or even 2nd or even 3rd
the pentafecta is a carryover bet which means if no one hits it on friday it will carryovered to saturday-minus the takeout
a 3 box trifecta bet is $6,4 is $24,6 horse tribox is $60
these exotic bets should be used with moderate to longshots keyed with other horses
the exacta payouts can be viewed on the screen but the other exotic payouts are unknown to the bettor

cre8flow · Group Performer Joined: 28 Mar 2006 Posts: 1921

Death n Taxes · Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 4:58 pm Post subject:

sorry cre8flow didn,t understand a word of that.
_________________
There are two certainties in life Death and Taxes they no longer tax betting so there may be a god

Grand National 2009 Comp Winner
September October 2009 NAP Comp Winner

cre8flow · Group Performer Joined: 28 Mar 2006 Posts: 1921

well
lets say you wanted to play a $20 pick 3 starting with the dirt mile
mastercraftsman with spanish moon,dar re mi,conduit with rip van winkle
or 1 /257 /10
1x3x1=3 x amount of bet-$20=$60 is total cost of the bet

Jimbob · Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 5:35 pm Post subject:

cre8flow · Group Performer Joined: 28 Mar 2006 Posts: 1921

there is a win pool a place pool and a show pool

a win -place bet is actually two different bets
the win bet your horse must win
the place bet your horse can finish first or second but you win the place payout not the win payout
lets say you bet rip van winkle to place and win
he finishes 1st and you win both bets-the win bet and the place bet
across the board bet is win place and show 3 different bets
if yor horse wins you win all 3 of your bets
if your horse finishes 2nd you win the place bet and the show bet but you lose the win bet
if he finishes 3rd you only win your show bet
the win place and show payouts are almost always different

Jimbob · Posted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 5:59 pm Post subject:

lenahan · Group Performer Joined: 24 Sep 2006 Posts: 1421

A win-place is just another word for an 'each way' bet jimbob. Your backing the horse to both win and place. Except it will only pay for 1st or 2nd place and not 3rd like in most races here.

WIN = 1st
PLACE = 1st or 2nd
SHOW = 1st, 2nd or 3rd

Dont get caught out backing to PLACE and thinking its like here where your horse can come top 3 as its only top 2. You need to back show to get a payout for a 3rd place finish. I tend to just back win and show and ignore backing place.

This is probably the most improtant thing for people to be aware of this weekend if taking US prices.

REMEMBER:

WIN = 1st PLACE = 1st or 2nd ONLY
SHOW = 1st, 2nd or 3rd

DONT GET CAUGHT OUT ON BACKING A HORSE TO PLACE THAT FINISHES THIRD! YOU NEED TO BACK SHOW TO GET A PAYOUT FOR A THIRD PLACE FINISH

cre8flow · Group Performer Joined: 28 Mar 2006 Posts: 1921

a win-place bet is just another way of saying

$20 to win and place
the total you must pay is $40
you would tell the teller $20 to win and place on the 10
if you say $20 across the board on the 10 to the teller
its just another way of saying
$20 to win place and show-3 different bets on the 10
and so you must pay the teller $60

cre8flow · Group Performer Joined: 28 Mar 2006 Posts: 1921

lenahan · Group Performer Joined: 24 Sep 2006 Posts: 1421

Do the Pick 3, Pick 4, Pick 6 etc tend to pay more than just doing a normal treble or accumulator bet ?

Would you not be better off just backing your selection to win the first leg as a normal win bet in the pool and then rolling it over onto the second leg in the win pool and so on ?

Im quite interested in some of these combo bets for this weekend inlcuding standard exactas and so on as i think there could be some good value about.

Also what sites are best for keeping a live look at the tote odds for the us pools during the day and is it comes to the off ? Would be interesting to see where to money is going throughout the afternoon tommoro and satuday ?

Cheers

cre8flow · Group Performer Joined: 28 Mar 2006 Posts: 1921

its just a guess but for the bc i would say the pick 4 pays more
probably the pick 3 too
the value of the pick 4 has diminished as people get a handle on it
the pick 6 is a $2 minimum bet and the the friday will carryover to saturday
if the friday carries over to saturday the pick 6 is almost always a great bet
but you need a lot of capital to play the bet
a negative is the taxes you will pay on anything 600-1 and as a foreigner i dont know how that works-as an american i can write them off
5000-1 and they take it off 28% right off the top
so for foreigners stay with the lower paying exotics-exactas without favs- are the best-you will get great value-not exactly sure what sites-youbet.com or betfair
the pick 4 on friday is offered in the 1st 5th,6th
on saturday 3rd,6th and 7th
with exacta bet $1 dollar exacta boxes to avoid the taxes
crushing a pick 3 might be great but break up say the pick 3s into $1 increments