Parsons Legacy
|
Punting For A LivingLets face it beyond the scope of most of us but sometimes wonder if its all its cracked up to be. You have to do a lot of study, stress, research etc etc, and at the end of the day you arent guaranteed a wage at the end of the week. Id be interested to know what sort of annual income a typical pro gambler makes? Perhaps a few on here would enlighten me..
|
Mansfield Toon
|
I would say if you are disciplined and are happy trading to make £3-4 per race (easily achievable), then you can make £80+ a day.
The trick is to trade out and green up before a race, and not worry about the racing once your staring at an all green screen.
I did 2 days over the easter holidays trying my hand at going pro.
Traded on anything I could find live on TV and made £130 over the sapce of the 2 days.
However, I was ill by the end of the 2 days, as my nerves were shot to pieces and I had lived on a diet of coffee and crisps. You are aslo chained to the PC and it gave me an awful headache. In short, I earn as much going to work as I did trading, and work is alot less stressful!!!
The only way is having massive bets on short priced favs when you are as sure as humanly possible that the horse will win.
|
RightJudgeIam
|
Low risk, value, controlled staking as % of bank, trade out when you can to limit liabilities... someone following my selections and staking instructions made £1300 in April to £7.50 a point... hard work, be prepared for losing runs ... not great fun and very tempting to stay up all night looking at form and markets...already feeling the pace after 2 months following a winter break (dec to feb) and need a holiday... just you don't know which day that one you make 1/3 is gonna be available at 20/1 ...
great fun though (sometimes)
|
Mansfield Toon
|
| RightJudgeIam wrote: | Low risk, value, controlled staking as % of bank, trade out when you can to limit liabilities... someone following my selections and staking instructions made £1300 in April to £7.50 a point... hard work, be prepared for losing runs ... not great fun and very tempting to stay up all night looking at form and markets...already feeling the pace after 2 months following a winter break (dec to feb) and need a holiday... just you don't know which day that one you make 1/3 is gonna be available at 20/1 ...
great fun though (sometimes) |
Very very thinly veiled look what I won thread IMVHO 
|
cre8flow
|
come on mansfield-80L a day?????????????????????
there are pros in this country who make hundreds of thousands of dollars a year-grant it they are in the small minority
i am no professional but i can tell you this
1)you must have tremendous desire and guts
2)you must have capital
3)you must be able to bet atleast a fair amount of money with tremendous relaxation
4)you must have talent and a sharp mind and a beautiful eye
5)you must be able to develop some sort of systemic or organized approach to the game
|
cre8flow
|
mansfield parsons asked a question
RJI answered the question
|
Mansfield Toon
|
| cre8flow wrote: | come on mansfield-80L a day?????????????????????
there are pros in this country who make hundreds of thousands of dollars a year-grant it they are in the small minority
i am no professional but i can tell you this
1)you must have tremendous desire and guts
2)you must have capital
3)you must be able to bet atleast a fair amount of money with tremendous relaxation
4)you must have talent and a sharp mind and a beautiful eye
5)you must be able to develop some sort of systemic or organized approach to the game |
£80 a day * 5 days a week = £400 a week =
£1600 a month. Not many on here will take home that money TAX FREE a month.
I dont care about the odd one or two making thousands, I'm talking about hard graft trading for £4 a race.
|
cre8flow
|
ther are other bettors who make a very good salary betting so much that they receive say 7% kick back on every dollar...i know a guy who breaks even but made $35k on the kickback...i think when pinnacle stopped taking american customers he had to take like 5% from bodog
|
Mansfield Toon
|
| cre8flow wrote: | | ther are other bettors who make a very good salary betting so much that they receive say 7% kick back on every dollar...i know a guy who breaks even but made $35k on the kickback...i think when pinnacle stopped taking american customers he had to take like 5% from bodog |
Never realised there was money to be made in flying sand...
|
Joe
|
| Mansfield Toon wrote: | | cre8flow wrote: | | ther are other bettors who make a very good salary betting so much that they receive say 7% kick back on every dollar...i know a guy who breaks even but made $35k on the kickback...i think when pinnacle stopped taking american customers he had to take like 5% from bodog |
Never realised there was money to be made in flying sand... |
Really? I'm suprised Toon- you're usually on the ball. Heck, it flew up and hit me in the eye when I saw that.
|
RightJudgeIam
|
For a more serious answer, I believe we are in a golden age for horse race betting. We have lots of races to choose from, 100% pure markets with plenty of liquidity in the exchanges, 'live' TV pictures and the ability to trade in running.
Choose your speciality whether it be 2yo maidens, 4yo handicappers, Group class sprinters, whatever..
organise and maintain a betting bank divided into enough betting points to sustain long, losing runs and protect your bank. Correct staking is essential to long term success.
Get really accurate at assessing the chances of runners or find a fantastic source of real info (this is very rare in my experience).
Be very disciplined, and prepared to take plenty of flak from friends and loved ones, cut out the sentimental and fun bets.
I use a bank of 100 points and I suggest that is a good level to start (whether you have £100 or £10K to start it doesn't matter). I bet between 1 and 10 points on any race and trade on most races to recover stakes where I can. On doubling the bank (100 points profit), double the value of your point and start again. Repeat process (hopefully). There are any number of ways to stake but having a bank and maintaining control of %age risk is crucial.
It is possible to make consistent profit and it's not easy. However, there is the opportunity for those prepared to work hard enough.
Who was it who said 'the harder I work, the luckier I get' ?
Good luck to all
|
Gamble__Landed
|
It was Gary Player, Judge.
|
alansouthcoast
|
Rick....If you havent already read it, try and get a copy of a book called Always Back Winner by Stewart Simpson ( Coronet Books 1981 )
He covers a seasons betting and only backs in mile handicaps, starting with a £1,000 bank and £50 a bet, doubling up as you say each time the bank doubles. By September he is backing at £400 a time and ends up with a bank of 18k. Its one of my favourite racing books, educational and also a fun read.
Regards....Alan
|
david-uk
|
Most of the heavy hitters bet to level stake, the same amount on each horse per point. This way you never regret finding a winner and lowering your stake. People like Henry Rix who makes a profit every year do it by the law of averages and hard study, he backs the longer priced horse and eventually he will hit it (a little like Pricewise, only Rix is better).
I think people who back odds on chances take a bigger risk as if one gets beat you are having to back 3 winners to get yourself back where you were.
Pro Gambling I think is for the serious person who gives up his day job and puts his cards on the table and says this is what I am going to, there are a lot of talkers that say it, but doing it is a different kettle of fish.
|
lochsong
|
I have now started to steadily claw back the £1000 that I went into the hole since I opened my BF account - whether that is due to my improving prowess (I hope some of it is) or a little help from my friends I'm beginning to see a light at the winning end of the losing tunnel - and I am glad for that.
LS
|
alansouthcoast
|
Lochsong two tips if i may. If you have found a system that works then stick with it. Dont try and claw back loses all at once, do it a little at a time. Once you have built up a bank then you can increase your stakes but dont go mad here, as has been said already, you are sure to hit another lean spell.
Regards...Alan
|
Mansfield Toon
|
I have one of those conscience's that wouldn't allow me to get £1000 in 'debt'...
|
RightJudgeIam
|
Alan
I started on BF in late 2002 with £1500 in BF following all four winners in a Lucky 15 which paid £4k - went on a huge streak and by Aintree 2003 had drawn enough so it was no longer worth working. Then set up PC, TV and started trading full time (nice chunk banked first though) - just turn the bank over until 100 points won and then order a cheque.
currently got 220 points in the bank so 1 point is actually 1/220th - will draw down when get to 300. The value of a point remains the same at all times and just grind it out with low risk.
It is possible for everyone and it doesn't matter whether it takes a week or six months to double. Repeat that process enough times and you can make good profits
regards
|
lochsong
|
| Mansfield Toon wrote: | | I have one of those conscience's that wouldn't allow me to get £1000 in 'debt'... |
Not debt, bozo, disposable income    I have a family to support - but getting it back and going into profit will be soooooooo sweet.
x
LS
|
david-uk
|
Judge
do you just bet full time on horses or all sports?
| RightJudgeIam wrote: | Alan
I started on BF in late 2002 with £1500 in BF following all four winners in a Lucky 15 which paid £4k - went on a huge streak and by Aintree 2003 had drawn enough so it was no longer worth working. Then set up PC, TV and started trading full time (nice chunk banked first though) - just turn the bank over until 100 points won and then order a cheque.
currently got 220 points in the bank so 1 point is actually 1/220th - will draw down when get to 300. The value of a point remains the same at all times and just grind it out with low risk.
It is possible for everyone and it doesn't matter whether it takes a week or six months to double. Repeat that process enough times and you can make good profits
regards |
|
alansouthcoast
|
| Mansfield Toon wrote: | | I have one of those conscience's that wouldn't allow me to get £1000 in 'debt'... |
Nice point Ant but look at it this way. If you bet £10 a day as many of us probably do, thats £70 a week. 15 weeks and thats your bank paid for. You dont actually need the total bank "Upfront" if you can fund each bet from weekly earnings.
Regards....Alan
|
cre8flow
|
what you are really doing is turning numbers on paper into money
i dont care what anybody says-that is mostly what is going on
you must be able to exclude horses-reduce your chance of losing while taking the value....therefore as judge says you must be able to be one of the best in the world at assessing what a horse is capable of at the time that you are betting
but a lot of people can do it without the pressure of making a bet
or without the pressure of having to produce on atleast a moderately consistent basis
|
cre8flow
|
maybe judge didnt say that...but i am saying it...in the states with a 15-25% takeout plus overhead you have to be one of the best
|
Mansfield Toon
|
| lochsong wrote: | | Mansfield Toon wrote: | | I have one of those conscience's that wouldn't allow me to get £1000 in 'debt'... |
Not debt, bozo, disposable income I have a family to support - but getting it back and going into profit will be soooooooo sweet.
x
LS |
But sweet cheeks you have still given it away.
I have lost £15 over the last 6 months on BF. I sickens me when I see that and am always deperately trying to win back to being in profit.
|
RightJudgeIam
|
David the vast majority of my profits (like 99%) come from betting on horses. And the majority of that comes from flat turf handicaps for older horses.
I am a sports fanatic (in terms of watching on TV) and I like to play around in things like the cricket world cup, French Open tennis, Snooker Worlds etc Dont do football although did back Italy in the semi final stage simply for value - got 9/2 and made them about 3/1 (evens for two matches). Sometimes I make a nice profit on these events but I made more on Twist Magic than I would in a year of sports betting.
Come on Pak Jack!!
|
lochsong
|
Judge
I think Jenny won that one!
|
RightJudgeIam
|
oh well I was very worried about him and he had beaten Jack before but hey, well done to Jen
|
YAIYAM
|
In this country (UK) we have better and a far wider range of betting opportunities on all sports than anywhere else in the world so although i guess there are still people who would only bet on horses to make money i would say it is one of the harder ways to do it, i mean even on this Forum there are maybe 5-10 people who make money on Golf betting every week now the only difference in what those people are winning is from there initial stakes some people are just not confident enough to put alot of money on or have other commitments which are more important I have been placing reasonable sized bets for along time and the size of the stake is what you just get used to.
I also think if someone really wanted to make money @ gambling and they thought they had the discipline they could do it the only trouble is people are not prepared to put in the time along side there day job maybe for 2/3 years to see if they can do it and then be prepared to give up that day job.
When i was still working i had a full years work where i earnt about £35-£40K but i also made £57K profit on gambling i gave up work for about 8 months and set myself up for my retirement(20 years down the line) i went back to work for about 3/4 years but bought a business at the same time i now have not had a full time job for over 2 years and win enough to not do so again
|
three out
|
I have an "semi-friend" who is a serious pro. He is the most unassuming guy in the world but he stakes seriously.
He started about 10 years ago when he was made redundant and had a big win on an acca roughly the same time. Decided to give himself 6 months with a £10k bank to see what he could do. He was seriously successful and he has never looked back. He has a beautifully custom build house on the river, a nice porsche and his mum lives the life of a queen.
His methods are very simple. He bets only on football (singles or doubles only) and horse racing (win singles only). He gets the RP each morning and spends a couple of hours looking for a horse that fits his profile. Footy bets take him about 30 minutes to decide on (he sticks to the top leagues in the UK I think). If he finds one horse he stops looking and places his bet. He will go days and weeks without having a bet. He then often takes the rest of day to take it easy and do what wealthy people do (play golf and the like). He bets to a percentage system (I follow the same system myself). I don't know his max bets but I know he places win singles of £5k plus regularly. He uses Betfair but is not a layer - he thinks layers are "plastic punters". He does not trade out in running either - he is an old fashioned punter. (He also calls me a mug for getting involved ante-post - as I say he is a top guy - he also says speed ratings are worthless most of the time ). I have been racing with him a few times and you would never know he is betting big or a pro - very much a normal bloke.
The key things I think that allow him to make it seriously pay are that he has a serious bank - enought that if he is on a losing streak he can still sleep like a baby. He sticks to what he is good at. He is also very centred and keeps himself to himself - never gives tips at all.
It can pay then but you need a few key attributes.
|
Mansfield Toon
|
That bloke sounds shroood.
I would love to go full time, be the best ever!!!
I can see the only way to do it with some safety net is to set up as a bookie on course with say a £20k bank and stick to small meets for a while.
Get to know the ropes like....
With books around 130%+ you cant go wrong in the long term, and you get to go racing everyday!
|
RightJudgeIam
|
Although I grind away making regular profit throughout the year, I am ever vigilant for the outstanding betting opportunity to win a life changing sum in one go.
When Red Lancer won at Chester at 14/1 (do you remember he was bought out of a Wolverhampton seller?), I won just shy of £35K and I regret still that I didn't bet it to win a 6 figure sum as it was one of the biggest value bets of all time.
I am still waiting for the next 'Red Lancer' and when it comes I will be in position to 'go for it'. Until then, discipline and grind to supply an income.
ps the one before that was Valiramix in the 2001 CH 
|
Mansfield Toon
|
RJII
When you next spot one, be sure to post it up!
|
YAIYAM
|
Mansfield Toon
I cannot remember how old you are early 20's @ a guess but i would say if you think you can generally make £80 a day i would take 2 weeks off work and see if you can do it if you can i would then do it at weekends as much as you can for about 6 months and if it works give up your job
|
three out
|
I remember Red Lancer as I was on and so it seemed was everybody I knew. Why on earth I wasn't on for more is a mystery as everybody seemed convinced it was a cert that day!
|
three out
|
| YAIYAM wrote: | Mansfield Toon
I cannot remember how old you are early 20's @ a guess but i would say if you think you can generally make £80 a day i would take 2 weeks off work and see if you can do it if you can i would then do it at weekends as much as you can for about 6 months and if it works give up your job |
Toon - I agree with YY. Why not give it a go but whatever you do set limits and retain discipline. There is definitely a living to be made if you stick to what you are good at. The time to do it is when you do not have too many dependancies. I regret not at least giving it a go a couple of years ago when I could have had a decent sized bank. Now I have a young family that bank is for other things.
|
Mansfield Toon
|
| YAIYAM wrote: | Mansfield Toon
I cannot remember how old you are early 20's @ a guess but i would say if you think you can generally make £80 a day i would take 2 weeks off work and see if you can do it if you can i would then do it at weekends as much as you can for about 6 months and if it works give up your job |
Not a chance in hell mate.
I did it for 2 days and was a mess. Staring at a screen for 12-14 hours a day is not for me. I'm a people person, get paid a decent wedge for doing an excellent job that I like and work with alot of decent folk.
No way I'm jacking that in to become a recluse chasing £4 a race!
Each to their own, if you can handle it fair play, but for me, gambling is a hobby and an interest.
|
Mansfield Toon
|
| three out wrote: | | YAIYAM wrote: | Mansfield Toon
I cannot remember how old you are early 20's @ a guess but i would say if you think you can generally make £80 a day i would take 2 weeks off work and see if you can do it if you can i would then do it at weekends as much as you can for about 6 months and if it works give up your job |
Toon - I agree with YY. Why not give it a go but whatever you do set limits and retain discipline. There is definitely a living to be made if you stick to what you are good at. The time to do it is when you do not have too many dependancies. I regret not at least giving it a go a couple of years ago when I could have had a decent sized bank. Now I have a young family that bank is for other things. |
No mate, my trades over those 2 days were crazy. I was risking 99% of bank sometimes on 1.02 etc. Bound to get caught out sometimes for sure.
I would get tired, lay and drop a major clanger at some point. Then the dream would be over.
|
YAIYAM
|
"I'm a people person, get paid a decent wedge for doing an excellent job that I like and work with alot of decent folk."
15 years down the line the same job does not always look so rosey just ask the older folk on here
"No way I'm jacking that in to become a recluse chasing £4 a race!"
I obviously do not knowhere you work but spending 8 hours a day in the same place for years on end is a party of recluses is it not
"Each to their own, if you can handle it fair play, but for me, gambling is a hobby and an interest."
If this is so and i ask many people this ? why did you back a 1/3 shot in Yeats the other day this is not Hobby/Fun/Interest betting it is betting to make money, Hobby/Fun/Interest betting is sticking a few quid on reasonable sized priced horses on TV races when you are watching racing.
|
cre8flow
|
YY-if he doesnt believe he can do it well its over he has no shot at being a professional gambler
most people can make a 5 footer on the golf course
but t takes a certain mentality to make a 5 footer with $50 on the line
you know it also takes a certain mentality to bet on a 10-1 shot
|
RightJudgeIam
|
| Mansfield Toon wrote: | | YAIYAM wrote: | Mansfield Toon
I cannot remember how old you are early 20's @ a guess but i would say if you think you can generally make £80 a day i would take 2 weeks off work and see if you can do it if you can i would then do it at weekends as much as you can for about 6 months and if it works give up your job |
Not a chance in hell mate.
I did it for 2 days and was a mess. Staring at a screen for 12-14 hours a day is not for me. I'm a people person, get paid a decent wedge for doing an excellent job that I like and work with alot of decent folk.
No way I'm jacking that in to become a recluse chasing £4 a race!
Each to their own, if you can handle it fair play, but for me, gambling is a hobby and an interest. |
I was doing a fantastic job that I really enjoyed but when the situation came that I was regularly betting more on one race than I earnt in a month it just wasn't worth it.
However, you can still continue to work,maintain a betting bank, bet with discipline, adhere to principles and gradually grow your bank, doubling the value of a 1 point bet evry time you double the bank... if you can do this consistently whilst continuing your job then you could supplement your income nicely.
Hobby it maybe but it's not golf i.e it doesn't have to cost a packet and isn't racing more fun when you win anyway?
|
Mansfield Toon
|
| Quote: | I'm a people person, get paid a decent wedge for doing an excellent job that I like and work with alot of decent folk."
15 years down the line the same job does not always look so rosey just ask the older folk on here |
Then if that is the case, I will think about gambling in 15 years time.
| Quote: | "No way I'm jacking that in to become a recluse chasing £4 a race!"
I obviously do not knowhere you work but spending 8 hours a day in the same place for years on end is a party of recluses is it not |
Everyday is different. Never have the same day twice in my working life.
| Quote: | "Each to their own, if you can handle it fair play, but for me, gambling is a hobby and an interest."
If this is so and i ask many people this ? why did you back a 1/3 shot in Yeats the other day this is not Hobby/Fun/Interest betting it is betting to make money, Hobby/Fun/Interest betting is sticking a few quid on reasonable sized priced horses on TV races when you are watching racing. |
Because a hobby is meant to be fun.....and a losing 10/1 is not as fun as a winning 1/3 maybe? Value? One of my favourite horses?
There is no way you can convince me YY. I have seen both sides of the coin. I have done my fair share of time strapped to Betfair scraping a measly £2 here and £3 there. It is not the life for me.
I would get bored, lose my discipline, go broke, chase losses, end up homeless and ruin my life.
Why on earth you are trying to persuade someone who does not want such a life is beyond me?
|
Mansfield Toon
|
| RightJudgeIam wrote: | | Mansfield Toon wrote: | | YAIYAM wrote: | Mansfield Toon
I cannot remember how old you are early 20's @ a guess but i would say if you think you can generally make £80 a day i would take 2 weeks off work and see if you can do it if you can i would then do it at weekends as much as you can for about 6 months and if it works give up your job |
Not a chance in hell mate.
I did it for 2 days and was a mess. Staring at a screen for 12-14 hours a day is not for me. I'm a people person, get paid a decent wedge for doing an excellent job that I like and work with alot of decent folk.
No way I'm jacking that in to become a recluse chasing £4 a race!
Each to their own, if you can handle it fair play, but for me, gambling is a hobby and an interest. |
I was doing a fantastic job that I really enjoyed but when the situation came that I was regularly betting more on one race than I earnt in a month it just wasn't worth it.
However, you can still continue to work,maintain a betting bank, bet with discipline, adhere to principles and gradually grow your bank, doubling the value of a 1 point bet evry time you double the bank... if you can do this consistently whilst continuing your job then you could supplement your income nicely.
Hobby it maybe but it's not golf i.e it doesn't have to cost a packet and isn't racing more fun when you win anyway? |
Cant do that. So wont be going 'pro'.
|
shamardal84
|
I am reading this thread with great interest as my ultimate goal is to make money from betting only in the long run.
Im 22 at the moment, and am hoping to get myself in a nice position to go into this full time, meaning I want to have £10k aside saved up that I have not calculated I will need to pay bills, going out etc and I can use that solely for betting and give it a 6 month trial run to see how it goes.
I estimate that time to being approximately 3/4 years time.
|
RightJudgeIam
|
| Mansfield Toon wrote: | | Quote: | I'm a people person, get paid a decent wedge for doing an excellent job that I like and work with alot of decent folk."
15 years down the line the same job does not always look so rosey just ask the older folk on here |
Then if that is the case, I will think about gambling in 15 years time.
| Quote: | "No way I'm jacking that in to become a recluse chasing £4 a race!"
I obviously do not knowhere you work but spending 8 hours a day in the same place for years on end is a party of recluses is it not |
Toon
I am not trying to convince you to do anything other than take a thoroughly sensible and professional approach to your staking. If you manage through careful betting to grow your bank over time, then increase your stakes in line with the profit but keep the %age at risk the same. As your bank grows, your stakes get bigger and the potential for larger returns increases.
I don't blame you for keeping your job, good income and security at all. Just trying to show you how you could do both.
regards
Everyday is different. Never have the same day twice in my working life.
| Quote: | "Each to their own, if you can handle it fair play, but for me, gambling is a hobby and an interest."
If this is so and i ask many people this ? why did you back a 1/3 shot in Yeats the other day this is not Hobby/Fun/Interest betting it is betting to make money, Hobby/Fun/Interest betting is sticking a few quid on reasonable sized priced horses on TV races when you are watching racing. |
Because a hobby is meant to be fun.....and a losing 10/1 is not as fun as a winning 1/3 maybe? Value? One of my favourite horses?
There is no way you can convince me YY. I have seen both sides of the coin. I have done my fair share of time strapped to Betfair scraping a measly £2 here and £3 there. It is not the life for me.
I would get bored, lose my discipline, go broke, chase losses, end up homeless and ruin my life.
Why on earth you are trying to persuade someone who does not want such a life is beyond me? |
|
YAIYAM
|
"Why on earth you are trying to persuade someone who does not want such a life is beyond me?"
I am not really trying to persuade you but Fair enough you have stated good reasons why you do not want to.
I will never be convinced by the argument from anyone that backing 1/3 shots favourite horses or not is for fun it is plain and simply to make money, i have favourite horses Moscow Flyer probably being No.1 but i would never have backed it @ short oddson i was just happy if he won
|
RightJudgeIam
|
| Mansfield Toon wrote: | RJII
When you next spot one, be sure to post it up! |
sure ...
but not until I'm on!
|
shamardal84
|
Ashkal Way was another of these dead cert nationwide gambles, when that won once everyone I knew had wads of cash on.
|
Mansfield Toon
|
| YAIYAM wrote: | "Why on earth you are trying to persuade someone who does not want such a life is beyond me?"
I am not really trying to persuade you but Fair enough you have stated good reasons why you do not want to.
I will never be convinced by the argument from anyone that backing 1/3 shots favourite horses or not is for fun it is plain and simply to make money, i have favourite horses Moscow Flyer probably being No.1 but i would never have backed it @ short oddson i was just happy if he won |
Betfair tells me this about my punting -
Betting P&L
Period: Last 3 HoursLast 6 HoursJust For TodayFrom YesterdayLast 7 daysLast 30 daysLast 3 Months Download to Spreadsheet
?
(relates to event settlement date)
(yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm) to
(yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm)
Cricket: -GBP10.93 | Golf: GBP0.00 | Horse Racing: GBP163.10 | Rugby Union: GBP0.85 | Soccer: -GBP9.87 Total P&L: GBP143.15
So call it £150 (all green book on the 2000 Guineas to come) over 3 months, ie £50 a month profit.
It pays for a night out, or a meal or something for the mrs.
I dont have the time to do any more study than I do and I'm happy ticking over what I have.
I realise the incentives are there for someone serious, and I respect those of you that do it.
For me the fun is in the selection, the discussion, and the action at the track.
It is certainly not spent chained to Betfair all my life!
|
RightJudgeIam
|
They don't come round very often and for me it's about knowing you have a massive amount in hand and having a handle on what every runner is capable of.
Valiramix was a classic example of this. His win in the Bula hurdle showed he had any amount in hand of his rivals (I had him a minimum 19lbs clear with a very large P). Fortunately, O'Brien was kind enough to run Istabraq in the race who went off at 3/1 JF with Val to hold up the price.
Unfortunately, we know what happened in the race itself. I didn't actually see the incident as I was watching in a bookies with my mate and as they jumped the 3rd last I turned to him and said ' Pete, this has pi$$ed up!'
When I turned back to the screen, Valiramix was stricken on the ground. Poor thing was on the verge of greatness.
Took a very long time to get over that one I assure you.
|
YAIYAM
|
I realise the incentives are there for someone serious, and I respect those of you that do it.
For me the fun is in the selection, the discussion, and the action at the track.
It is certainly not spent chained to Betfair all my life!
I totally agree Toon and i think the advantage i have is although sometimes i do spend long periods infront of the PC (not just gambling some of it is work for the business) I do get to go racing when i can(off to Salisbury this Sunday) and do not miss it when i am not gambling i can quite easily just decide i will not do it for a while and can stop.
I have just been away for 2/3 weeks and i am in a place with No PC, No telephone?(apart from if i go 20 minutes down the road where my mobile gets a signal), No TV and i do not even really think about it
|
RightJudgeIam
|
It is certainly not spent chained to Betfair all my life![/quote]
Toon it doesn't have to be whilst you are working. Just place your bets in your free time as you do now. Just suggesting you take a long term view and a profit-oriented attitude towards your punting, which does not mean trading on every event possible, desperately trying to claw your way to some necessary daily target; to this end I refer particularly to staking as the key (consistent, controlled and designed to minimise risk).
I am sure at some point you have had a sequence (a streak) of winning bets at fairly good prices. You know, you fancy one in a handicap which wins at 14s or whatever, get a tip that goes in and everything you bet seems to win. Most people have experienced this phenomenon if they bet regularly because the probabilities demand it if you have enough bets.
Anyway, correct staking over such a sequence (increasing as you double etc as mentioned before) can actually lead to significant profit.
Just thought I'd give you something to think over... doesn't mean chainingyourself to your PC mate or changing your life - just the way you bet.
Lecture over 
|
JDFUNKY
|
Can I ask YY and RJI - do you gain enjoyment from what you do? Is it solely the money that matters or the buzz of being proven right? You can tell me to p off for being nosey, but this thread shows everyone has thought about it and would enjoy being a pro gambler, but circumstances dictate, etc, etc.
Cheers
JDF
|
borismo
|
Without meaning to go off on a tangent, if you dont mind me asking what sort of firm you own yaiyam?
|
YAIYAM
|
| JDFUNKY wrote: | Can I ask YY and RJI - do you gain enjoyment from what you do? Is it solely the money that matters or the buzz of being proven right? You can tell me to p off for being nosey, but this thread shows everyone has thought about it and would enjoy being a pro gambler, but circumstances dictate, etc, etc.
Cheers
JDF |
do you gain enjoyment from what you do?
Yes because i am doing it for myself(family) not helping other people earn money
Is it solely the money that matters or the buzz of being proven right?
I would say i am not a materials sort of person and most of the money i make is not spent on me personally as i am not really into having a nice car(A-B anyway for me is OK) and i would certainly not buy a house in this country again(complete rip off). I certainly get more of a buzz when i pick a 20/1 shot than a 2/1 shot wether i win more on the 2/1 one or not
now p!ss off you nosey ,
|
YAIYAM
|
| borismo wrote: | | Without meaning to go off on a tangent, if you dont mind me asking what sort of firm you own yaiyam? |
I own a Restaurant
|
YAIYAM
|
| JDFUNKY wrote: | Can I ask YY and RJI - do you gain enjoyment from what you do? Is it solely the money that matters or the buzz of being proven right? You can tell me to p off for being nosey, but this thread shows everyone has thought about it and would enjoy being a pro gambler, but circumstances dictate, etc, etc.
Cheers
JDF |
There is also the fact that RJI bets mostly on horses where as as you know i like betting on Golf aswell as Tennis, Football and occasionally a few others
|
RightJudgeIam
|
| JDFUNKY wrote: | Can I ask YY and RJI - do you gain enjoyment from what you do? Is it solely the money that matters or the buzz of being proven right? You can tell me to p off for being nosey, but this thread shows everyone has thought about it and would enjoy being a pro gambler, but circumstances dictate, etc, etc.
Cheers
JDF |
To be honest it is pretty boring for the most part and I spend an awful lot of time just thinking. Some of this time is probably unnecessary but I find I just can't get by without it. Being 'right' hardly matters at all for me. making a profit does. If I was even more disciplined I would probably do better in terms of strike rate but ultimately it's the profit on turnover that counts (and this hard to calculate accurately as I often trade out in running).
Took 3 months off in december, jan and feb as was fully burned out after going hard at it all last flat season (and had a messy break up at the same time). Fortunate to be able to do that and certainly wouldn't want to rely on making £100 a day through trading - that would be stressful.
Don't get much buzz either really although did enjoy Scots Grey at Aintree because it was a thrilling race. Most of the time I'm betting on flat handicaps, working out who is 'well in', and it's not too exciting. I generally look for runners that should be placed if all goes to plan, bet them heavy in the place to guarantee a profit, smaller bets in the win and trade out to no loss. Had a run of 17 placed horses in a row last flat season - often with 8% or more of the bank on them to place. So you can easily see how that's not too exciting lol.
Does that answer your question?
|
Owl of Minerva
|
My biggest problem is that i lack the capital to make gambling work for me - i end up putting the same amount on slight fancies as i do on massive fancies due to the fact that i can't sustain many losses. I'm pretty sure that if someone gave me £30k to play with i could make a decent profit but thats obviously not going to happen.
Either way i don't think i'd want to be a proffesional gambler - i'd rather channel my energies into making a lot of cash in business/career and play big stakes on Saturdays and days at the races - still treating it seriously to make money but also enjoying it. I don't think i could take the way 'losing big' makes me feel too often! - perhaps this feeling would disappear if i could actually afford to lose - hence by the time i am 40 i may reconsider my views on becoming a professional gambler.
But i do think it would be a bit sad for a really young person to be a pro gambler - they should be out meeting people and living life, not cooped up in their house with sweaty palms and a fast beating heart for half the day, constantly thinking about where the next big win is coming from!!
I do admire people who can make it pay though. I just hope it doen't totally consume them every minute of the day like i think it would me if i did it professionally.
Owl
|
cre8flow
|
i dont like the grinding of it all-i want the big score or nothing at all-am learning to take profits but i would rather watch paint dry....
i cant get excited about american dirt and poly claiming races...very difficult for me to focus...i despise the obvious,the chalk
give me complex turf races and i am in heaven
|
Joe
|
Do you proffesionals not lose the fun element though? I have a punt because I enjoy it rather than for the money, and don't usually bet in the week and look forward to a saturday morning picking a few out then watching them in the afternoon...If I had to rely on myself to pick winners every day to put food on the table that would really sap the enjoyment from it from me. Or is it not like that? I appreciate you have a big enough bankroll to sustain the losses but there must be quite an added sense of pressure on yourself that would remove the enjoyment? 
|
RightJudgeIam
|
Owl
it does become all consuming if you allow it to. One of the reasons I moved to Spain was for exactly those reasons. I hardly know any other punters over here, although I also know there are some. I've made plenty of contacts in my field of therapeutic bodywork (I'm a DeepTissue Massage Therapist by training), exchanging treatments, volunteering for charity events and attending all the 'Healing Arts' festivals here in Andalucia. I get to keep my hand in by treating friends at my flat and a few people get referred to me when they have a problem. Actually, I get most of the benefits I associate with my work without the complication of actually building a practice and running a business, which I can assure you is very hard in my field. Certainly, working as a sole therapist on a one-to-one basis I could never achieve the level of income I have done in the last few years and I was never interested in running a business, expanding, employing people and all that to make my practice really profitable.
For a while there before I went full time, I was doing trades on BF in between clients and it got to the stage where I was having £250 to win and £750 to place on 6/1 plus shots that were nearly all placing (as you saw last year), then receiving a client and giving a treatment for an hour to earn £50.
I really don't think I could have done this in my twenties (at the time I thought I was going to get one of those £500K Lucky 63 bets you sometimes hear about) but now in my 40s it's different. Gonna shake things up and move to France in the near (ish future).
regards
|
cre8flow
|
let me think about efficient formulas to bet the superfecta...how to bet exotics...how to master them in relation to the most important factors...but if i study 6f dirt and poly claiming races on a daily basis i will end up in the looney bin.....
|
RightJudgeIam
|
John it's a totally different game over here.. the exotic bets just don't exist and if they did would be virtually impossible to collect...I don't like the grind either and as you know I am constantly looking for the life changer and am more than willing to step out of the grind when it comes...that game is about recognising the opportunity when it presents itself... there was one in April last year at the Aintree Festival that just passed... was in a handicap and I did hit hard enough at the 10/1 available... the horse glided home like a 1/10 shot and it was only afterwards that I realised I should have had 10 or 20 times the stake, especially with an easy place bet to cover available..
when all the circumstances come together I'm gonna do it .. I just don't know when
|
cre8flow
|
me too Rick i am going to grind and then KABOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
|
RightJudgeIam
|
You know John that thought is with me constantly... it's one of the things that makes it worthwhile knowing that when I log on and start going through my stuff that maybe today it'll be there ... the staring, obvious, can't get beat stone cold stormer that no one else can see just begging to be hammered to oblivion...and it's 20/1 (well ok 10/1 will do fine)...
it's just around the corner and I am armed and ready to shoot..
as you say ''KABOOOM'' and as we say ''good night Irene''
|
DunDoire
|
Ive fired my bullets on Finsceal Beo for the last while judgie averaging 7.6 for the 1000 guinnes.
But, ive now layed all the stake off (at 2.5 - 2.7 it was just getting too tempting) throughout today. The free bet i have on her now is quite staggering. I normally dont lay off but this was beautiful. I'll not sleep this weekend between her and teofilo, my nerves are jarred.
Id also like to contribute to the post about gambling for a living but ive done it before and its just not worth the abuse. After all some people believe "cockwaving" (yes thats what i was accused off) is too much to take.
One thing though - Whoever said the could not handle being in "debt" i say this: if you dont borrowing in the beginning in life then its a hell of a lot harder to go places.......just my opinion though.
DD
|
RightJudgeIam
|
Really well done with your trade DD - hope it comes off for you.
wont be betting in those and I dont do ante post (often) so will be cheering them home!! Beers on you if they do!
|
DunDoire
|
Cheers judge - i just had to lay it tho. I had a couple of K on betfair at juicy prices and the rest with the old enemy.........just not the same when your laying it tho and not all the stake is on bf.........actually have to get the calculator out for a change!!!
God its late - im going to bed...........zzzzzzzzz
PS-Antepost of betfair is a money spinner for me imho, the oppertunities are endless...........
|
Tagalie
|
| DunDoire wrote: | Id also like to contribute to the post about gambling for a living but ive done it before and its just not worth the abuse. After all some people believe "cockwaving" (yes thats what i was accused off) is too much to take.
|
DD, it was me who found some of your previous comments a bit self-aggrandising, in the context of that particular thread. This thread has been totally different- a real indication of how this community has grown, as people obviously feel quite comfortable talking about finances and individual circumstances, which is a very personal topic of conversation. I still view betting as quite a private thing- sometimes people I go racing with mention their stake, sometimes not- I would never ask, as I don't think it's any of my business. Perhaps I am just old-fashioned.
I suppose I'm in a privileged position because I've been lucky enough to meet up with many posters, several of whom I now consider good friends. When you've been racing with people you get a clearer idea of their situation and gambling attitude- from fun £2 bets on the Tote, to serious a-p wagers and large trackside punts. It's a bit different to an online persona casually talking about the large figures they're staking. This is not to say you (or any other poster) is some kind of liar, or to imply that you can only be believed if someone's met you in RL! This particular thread has shown a clear divide in age/circumstances, with those in their 20s seeming to be far more reluctant to commit to the kind of bank and effort that is required for "serious" pro gambling. As you are (IIRC) in your mid 20s, I think it's fair to say that it is unusual for someone at that stage in life to have enough to apparently regularly bet 4 figure sums. That doesn't mean you're expected to post up your CV and bank details for verification of course, that's ridiculous. I'm just trying to explain why some posts can grate a bit and rub people up the wrong way.
Although I've been interested in racing since I was a teenager, I'm fairly new to betting, and I do find it intriguing to observe how gamblers interact. I do think it's fair to say that there is a level of competitiveness that has a distinctly testosterone-fuelled edge, in terms of swagger and touchiness.
Anyway, we're all united against the bookies, pros or not.
|
Parsons Legacy
|
Thanks for that Rick. I can now see where I am going wrong, its simple, all I need is a starting bank, pick winners, double banks double stakes and then start again. I wil pack in my job tommorow and go full time.
|
Sky_Of_Darkness
|
| Parsons Legacy wrote: | | Thanks for that Rick. I can now see where I am going wrong, its simple, all I need is a starting bank, pick winners, double banks double stakes and then start again. I wil pack in my job tommorow and go full time. |
It would be a shame for such a good thread (one of the best ever on here IMO) to be spoilt by unnecessarily sarcastic comments, when people are just explaining their own particular situation.
|
DunDoire
|
| Tagalie wrote: | | DunDoire wrote: | Id also like to contribute to the post about gambling for a living but ive done it before and its just not worth the abuse. After all some people believe "cockwaving" (yes thats what i was accused off) is too much to take.
|
DD, it was me who found some of your previous comments a bit self-aggrandising, in the context of that particular thread. This thread has been totally different- a real indication of how this community has grown, as people obviously feel quite comfortable talking about finances and individual circumstances, which is a very personal topic of conversation. I still view betting as quite a private thing- sometimes people I go racing with mention their stake, sometimes not- I would never ask, as I don't think it's any of my business. Perhaps I am just old-fashioned.
I suppose I'm in a privileged position because I've been lucky enough to meet up with many posters, several of whom I now consider good friends. When you've been racing with people you get a clearer idea of their situation and gambling attitude- from fun £2 bets on the Tote, to serious a-p wagers and large trackside punts. It's a bit different to an online persona casually talking about the large figures they're staking. This is not to say you (or any other poster) is some kind of liar, or to imply that you can only be believed if someone's met you in RL! This particular thread has shown a clear divide in age/circumstances, with those in their 20s seeming to be far more reluctant to commit to the kind of bank and effort that is required for "serious" pro gambling. As you are (IIRC) in your mid 20s, I think it's fair to say that it is unusual for someone at that stage in life to have enough to apparently regularly bet 4 figure sums. That doesn't mean you're expected to post up your CV and bank details for verification of course, that's ridiculous. I'm just trying to explain why some posts can grate a bit and rub people up the wrong way.
Although I've been interested in racing since I was a teenager, I'm fairly new to betting, and I do find it intriguing to observe how gamblers interact. I do think it's fair to say that there is a level of competitiveness that has a distinctly testosterone-fuelled edge, in terms of swagger and touchiness.
Anyway, we're all united against the bookies, pros or not. |
Thats fair enough Tags (i shouldn't of mentioned it again - but i was in a bad mood last night!), i do understand where you are coming - the waving comment just annoyed me tho (not on a "you're a liar" level but on a "you dont even know me" level) i guess the same way it may annoy people when i talk about my bets. I have tried to curtail talking about amounts etc. for this specfic reason (unless someone pm's me or we are talking on msn and they ask).
Im not sure about the distinct "testosterone-fuelled edge" - if i feel annoyed about a certain comment i certainly could not boil it down to this, but then again its very hard to take an impartial view.
I am indeed mid twenties, i guess im lucky in the fact that i have a reasonably good and very secure job and have pulled off some nice punting coups in the past. I really am a racing fanatic at heart - i just love the game - and the more i can get of it the better. I guess its all about networking to a certain degree from a punting perspective, building up a pool of reliable contacts that you feel you can trust.
I do take your point about meeting people from the forum - i actually think if people from this forum met me they would be quite suprised.............
|
david-uk
|
Totally agree Sky
This has been the best thread ever on here, it's nice to get to know where people are at with there punting etc. The serious, the players and the fun gamblers.
|
DunDoire
|
I agree Sky - while im actually not going to contribute in debt about my gambling (just feels ive been through it before so its like flogging an old cat) i think its been a great thread. Listing to RJI brings me back to the days of Shes our Mare winning the cambridgshire - probably still my favourite ap gamble of all time - prob because i was still at school and raked it in!!!
If you dont have something constructive to add to this thread please please dont ruin it with sarcasm.
DD
|
Owl of Minerva
|
Agreed; great thread; lets keep it that way. Parsons, sarcasm can be amusing when used selecvtively, but by using it in 90% of your posts, the effect is (has) wearing (worn) off!
Owl
|
alansouthcoast
|
| Sky_Of_Darkness wrote: | | Parsons Legacy wrote: | | Thanks for that Rick. I can now see where I am going wrong, its simple, all I need is a starting bank, pick winners, double banks double stakes and then start again. I wil pack in my job tommorow and go full time. |
It would be a shame for such a good thread (one of the best ever on here IMO) to be spoilt by unnecessarily sarcastic comments, when people are just explaining their own particular situation. |
As i said before you dont actually need a starting bank. If you lose £20 a week on several bets use that. Decide how much your bank will be, for example £200 bank allows you ten weekly bets of £20. If You get £400 in the bank then double up. If the bank gets wiped out, its only what you would have gambled anyway, so start again.
Sky..... Nice comment.
Tagalie....Fair play for explaining what you meant, although i have found in my experience most guys in the bookies are really pleased when someone has a good win. So while it is boasting as such, its not in a negative way.
In reply to do professionals enjoy it....While its tense and stressful i doubt any of them would prefer a 9 til 5 job instead. Im sure many can relax enough to enjoy the racing as well.
|
Owl of Minerva
|
| shamardal84 wrote: | | Ashkal Way was another of these dead cert nationwide gambles, when that won once everyone I knew had wads of cash on. |
I remember that one well. It was a 10f handicap at Beverley - he had a great piece of form behind Enforcer at Goodwood going into the race, was well drawn, had a top 5lb claimer up for the first time (Chris Hayes) in a moderate race and the bookies opened up 5/1 in the morning. GOt smashed into all day and went off at like 9/4 or 2/1! Hosed up.
Had a big bet for me at the time and at no point was i nervous; it was such a ceetainty!!
Owl
God i love it !
|
kickingkyle
|
Is a very good read. If i was in the financial position to start "pro" then i think id go for it. The problem is i am no where near that. I do have lapses in discipline which i hope in a couple of years will change. I am only 20 at the minute so hopefully that could all change. I dont bet that big but i think i need to change my betting style as i am £- for the year.
One positive im starting my personal training course next weds (well entry exam 1st) but should have 1st client starting soon to free up some £££
|
SIR_Bond
|
| Sky_Of_Darkness wrote: | | Parsons Legacy wrote: | | Thanks for that Rick. I can now see where I am going wrong, its simple, all I need is a starting bank, pick winners, double banks double stakes and then start again. I wil pack in my job tommorow and go full time. |
It would be a shame for such a good thread (one of the best ever on here IMO) to be spoilt by unnecessarily sarcastic comments, when people are just explaining their own particular situation. |
Get used to it with Parsons Legacy he seems to have a probelm with sarcastic comments.
|
Sky_Of_Darkness
|
Some excellent posts on this thread which show how diverse even the 'concept' of being a professional gambler is.
1. Why would you become a pro-gambler
We have all sorts of ideas. Some to get away from the drudgery of a regular 9 till 5 job. Some to be able to make different choices in their life through a higher income. Some maybe even because the 'idea' of being a pro-gambler sounds so exciting - even if this may not be the case. Two examples are Mansfield Toon & RJI, who are on very different (note I say different - not better or worse) stages of their lives. Both felt the excess pressure too much after a certain point and both needed a break from the 'life behind the screen' attempting to get the "all green".
2. What consitutes a successful pro-gambler.
Again we have a wide range of ideas and comments to consider.
Someone trading to win 100 / week is no different from someone trading at ten times that figure. It's all about each individual's circumstances, their lifestyle (current and required) and what they are prepared to risk / give-up in order to achieve their ultimate goal or need.
3. Where does the fun element start / stop. Varies from person to person.
4. What is the best method?
Reading through there seem to be numerous ways / manners in which to attempt to go pro, not all destined to succeed, but each with it's own merits and each person needs to decide which one suits their own individual personality.
As for me.
I have the utmost respect for anyone who has the discipline (which in my opinion is the biggest factor in being a successful gambler) to do this. Everyone has their own system for want of a better word, but if you lack / lose the discipline that makes this system work, then you are immediately on the slippery slope. I know this first hand, having had an 18 month spell (which initially was very successful, but loss of discpline untimately returned me back to the world of a regular job) of being a full time gambler.
I have ideas of going back for a second go at some point, but time will tell if I have discovered enough self-control for this to be successful. Good luck to each and everyone of you in yor punting, whether it be saturday afternoon fun, to put food on the table or just extravagant rashness with your healthy wad.
Let's beat those bookies!!!!!!
|
Flatz
|
I would just like to add that I also think that this thread is a good read. It has been very interesting to hear everyone's views. I do dabble a bit on punting, but mainly on darts and football, where I do like to have about 3 or 4 big sized punts a season at large odds (3/1 or above), and usually smaller stakes throughout the season (singles only as a general rule, and on teams that are better than evens). I have also used Betfair this season to lay teams in-running a few times to guarantee a profit. Let me say that I have of course had a fair share of losers as well!!
As for the horses, I always like to follow the views of the posters on this forum, and I admire anybody who makes a profit as IMO I think that it is a really hard sport to make money on. Generally I will only bet on the horses if I'm going to a meeting, but I have followed some of the advice/tips on here from time to time, and I would say that I am a few quid up, so thanks for that and keep up the good work!
Cheers
Flatz
|
Flatz
|
Just forgot to add that Sky is correct in that the most important thing when punting is discipline, and it is a very hard art to master. I thought that I was nearly there earlier on this year, but I still have the odd lapse. That is why I could never consider becoming a full-time pro.
Cheers
Flatz
|
SIR_Bond
|
Even if you did become professional surely it wouldnt make sense to pack in yor day job. Clearly if you keep your day job your gonna be eanring more money anyway. I also think its possiable to work full time and make money from betting.
Since ive started work full time (4months) now ive not spent a penny of my wages but ive spent loads of money on going out clothes etc etc.
If i can carry this on i can work full time and not have to spend any of my wages let that build up ad live off money from gambling.
At the moment i dont have any bills to pay cause im living at home so this clearly helps but im very happy with my situation at the minute and hope i can carry it on.
I really need to start recording all my bets from now on so i can start controlling more what im betting and know what im spending. I know that im due for a lsoing run sooner or later but if i can get through it the only way is up.
|
kickingkyle
|
Just gone throguh my bets and April was my 1st winning month on the horses, good news as the others had been very bad. Still 3 figues to claw back!
|
Sky_Of_Darkness
|
| SIR_Bond wrote: | | Even if you did become professional surely it wouldnt make sense to pack in yor day job. Clearly if you keep your day job your gonna be eanring more money anyway. |
The answer to this depends on what the person wishes to earn / make through gambling, their current job etc etc.
Example.
If someone is earning 100 pounds / week, but find they can make 400 / week through gambling, why would they carry on working 40 hours / week.
Could those 40 hours be invested in order to further maximise the profits from gambling? Alternatively, could those 40 hours be used to enjoy (golfing etc) the profits made from gambling?
|
SIR_Bond
|
Can anyone give me some advice on how i should turn money figures into betting figures eg converting money into just gambeling figures.
So i can record my bets easiyer and create a system for punting on horses.
So a starting bank of £2000 to gamble so say one point a pound ??
As you can tell i dont record any bets or have any system i just bet what i think its worth.
Any help much appreciated cheers
|
DunDoire
|
| SIR_Bond wrote: | Can anyone give me some advice on how i should turn money figures into betting figures eg converting money into just gambeling figures.
So i can record my bets easiyer and create a system for punting on horses.
So a starting bank of £2000 to gamble so say one point a pound ??
As you can tell i dont record any bets or have any system i just bet what i think its worth.
Any help much appreciated cheers |
Dude if you have any kind of simple microsoft excel skills you will be able to make something that records your bets easily. You should make it so (if you use betfair) the info exports easily to excel from your account with betfair.
|
SIR_Bond
|
I do have a basic knowledge of excel but i dont bet on betfair cause im at work mostly so i bet up the old fashioned bookies at lunch or at weekends up there.
|
Saint Alebe
|
| SIR_Bond wrote: | Can anyone give me some advice on how i should turn money figures into betting figures eg converting money into just gambeling figures.
So i can record my bets easiyer and create a system for punting on horses.
So a starting bank of £2000 to gamble so say one point a pound ??
As you can tell i dont record any bets or have any system i just bet what i think its worth.
Any help much appreciated cheers |
I am not pro but have discussed this with a few and a some pointers I learnt were to not bet more than 5% of your bank in one bet so a max bet on £2000 would be £100 this way you can take a few loses and still be able to carry on. Some people go 10% but that is off course a personal preference.
Others work on a points basis (which is sort of the same depending on your max bet) with say 10 points being the maximum. If £100 is you max bet then 1 point = £10. depending on how much you fancy a horse determines how many points you give it.
End of ther day its up to you on what your max bet is but stick to it as you need to be able to take a few hits when you go on a loosing run.
Good luck
Saint
|
SIR_Bond
|
Nice one it makes more sense now.
I guess i need to find a formula or system thats suits my income and the money i have now.
|
RightJudgeIam
|
| Saint Alebe wrote: | | SIR_Bond wrote: | Can anyone give me some advice on how i should turn money figures into betting figures eg converting money into just gambeling figures.
So i can record my bets easiyer and create a system for punting on horses.
So a starting bank of £2000 to gamble so say one point a pound ??
As you can tell i dont record any bets or have any system i just bet what i think its worth.
Any help much appreciated cheers |
I am not pro but have discussed this with a few and a some pointers I learnt were to not bet more than 5% of your bank in one bet so a max bet on £2000 would be £100 this way you can take a few loses and still be able to carry on. Some people go 10% but that is off course a personal preference.
Others work on a points basis (which is sort of the same depending on your max bet) with say 10 points being the maximum. If £100 is you max bet then 1 point = £10. depending on how much you fancy a horse determines how many points you give it.
End of ther day its up to you on what your max bet is but stick to it as you need to be able to take a few hits when you go on a loosing run.
Good luck
Saint |
Very smart answer Saint - approve entirely
Once you have doubled your bank (I know it's not that easy but it is the name of the game), double the value of your maximum bet and therefore the value of a 1 point bet.
This way the percentage risk remains the same. It doesn't matter how long it takes.. all the while you are betting in this controlled manner, recording your bets, profit on turnover etc you are providing yourself with data about your own betting behaviour which can help you improve your success. By the time you have been doing this for several hundred or thousand bets you will easily see where you are making money and where not. Take the long term view.
Anybody could do this at the same time as holding down a job. Someone I know started with £200 in his BF account in September and has been running a points system since. Has now reached £1000+ and hopes to get to £3-4K by end of flat season- and he's still working. Slow - ish
progress... but it is progress, with little risk and hardly any impact on his working life.
|
SIR_Bond
|
Interesting
Very Interesting
|
JDFUNKY
|
| YAIYAM wrote: | | now p!ss off you nosey XCENSOREDX |
YaiYam - are you trying to tell me something.......... !!!
Next question - is watching races essential in a pro gamblers life? It may be a stupid question, but I've noticed that you RJI seem to use Topspeed, etc to determine whether a horse is worth betting on - is it just numbers adding up for you or do you watch the races as well and keep a notebook??
Cheers for being so candid guys, this is really interesting!!!
JDF
|
lochsong
|
| JDFUNKY wrote: | is it just numbers adding up for you or do you watch the races as well and keep a notebook??
|
This intrigues me also JD - because the way these guys talk you would think they must be glued to the tele all afternoon every day. But I suspect that a good memory comes into play, and in selected races that are watched the noting of performances by not only the winner but the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th horse etc come into play at a later date.
I'm trying to learn that skill but in the mean time reading the form in RP will have to do ( for what that's worth)
LS
|
JDFUNKY
|
I have followed the selections of a couple of the guys on here (not bet on, just looked and see why they have picked them out) - I've noticed with YaiYam (sorry to use you as an example!), but collateral form comes into play, i.e. how many winners have come out of a particular race, etc. The RP have the 'Racecheck' at the bottom of each race a horse runs in which shows how many have won in the next 2 races, placed in the next 2 races and unplaced - therefore, do you have to have seen the race or just use this as a pointer? Also, if it was a 20 runner race and the 1st 5 have come out and won again, do you look at the 6th, 7th, 8th, etc and back them next time, or would you need to look at the race and see how the 6th, 7th, 8th, ran before picking it out?
So many questions I know!!!!
JDF
|
RightJudgeIam
|
| lochsong wrote: | | JDFUNKY wrote: | is it just numbers adding up for you or do you watch the races as well and keep a notebook??
|
This intrigues me also JD - because the way these guys talk you would think they must be glued to the tele all afternoon every day. But I suspect that a good memory comes into play, and in selected races that are watched the noting of performances by not only the winner but the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th horse etc come into play at a later date.
I'm trying to learn that skill but in the mean time reading the form in RP will have to do ( for what that's worth)
LS |
err have to watch.. including replays and yes I have a very large memory bank so I say to myself, when I'm looking at the form later on, things like 'oh, yeah that was the race where x,y and z happened'. Helps a lot.
I'm a ratings man too - use them to sort the wheat from the chaff... that's a big subject though
|
GP
|
Im reading with interest too! Thanks guys, fascinating.
Here's my position....
I'm hugely UP at the moment. The money i have 'made' in this last few months is under the matress! ok not quite the mattress more a box...
With Gambling (and most things in life), Winning is never certain, especially long term and like alot of you guys say, its being able to be clever with money and juggle as well.
But...i have been firm with myself because it's all too easy to chase your bets and give it right back.
I have then withdrawn directly the profit each day/every two days back into my bank account (some days its not much, others its a few Hundred) leaving a small amount to play with. I think that's what most are saying leave a pool of money after expenses (stakes).
I can honestly sit here and say, not one penny of what i have Won has been spent on myself....i'm not just throwing you a line here, it's true.
As soon as the money shows in my current account, i go draw out the cash and put it in the Lyrann fund box. All in all, the horses are paying for the horses if you see what i mean....
Winnings have covered all his tack, feed, hayladge, straw and shaving for months, plus rugs and other stuff for him and the other horses (and i just took another £200 out for feeds tomorrow).
I suppose now ive bought the most expense items, perhaps i can do something else with the profit i make, IF, it continues.
The only thing i guess i havent really done, which has been suggested, is tried upping my stakes (the odd time i'll do a Fiver or Ten) but mostly its £2 or £3 as all here know.
Perhaps take the Fav or second Fav, if thats what you like, but also consider the huge priced e/w horse as well, it really does pay off
I think people on the tv and radio just get too swamped with Stats and loose the feel of a race at times or even don't even give some horses a mere mention, is this fear or what? They say....deserves that big price etc or Huh NO Chance lol My question is always....Er Why Not?
Always did Love the Underdog!
|
jennywales
|
You probably all know my gambling "philosophy". I only bet for fun, and until I discovered Betfair (!) only when I actually went racing.
My stakes are small (usually minimum). My max bet is £25 (ooooooohhhh  )
I don't expect to make a profit; if I break even over the year I am happy, my fun has been free! If I am down, I count it as money well spent on my hobby (for example, if I went on with flying as a hobby it would cost me £80 an hour!) I am lucky in that I really enjoy my work, which is well-paid, and therefore I don't want to give it up (not many jobs get you to Azerbaijan in December and Rwanda in May - I hope!)
I love racing for itself- the gambling and the excitement that goes with it is extra.
But when I put on a bet I do like to study, as this is part of the fun. I am not a great one for the maths and the speed figures. I like to look at the form, all the factors, and the "feel" of the race. I think seeing the horses run is very important, and even though it costs 20p a go I use the RP video form quite a lot, as I don't have RUK or ATR. But I bet I spend less on the video form than I would on having the satellite!
I enjoy specialising (hunter chases and amateur/conditionals races for me). I take money out of my betting account as soon as I am sufficiently over my pot - this means I get money back and use it (usually) to pay for a day at the races!
I am a happy penny punter - but I am always looking to widen my knowledge. Keep it simple, keep it fun, that is my motto!!
A most interesting thread, thanks to all contributors.
|
Saint Alebe
|
| JDFUNKY wrote: | I have followed the selections of a couple of the guys on here (not bet on, just looked and see why they have picked them out) - I've noticed with YaiYam (sorry to use you as an example!), but collateral form comes into play, i.e. how many winners have come out of a particular race, etc. The RP have the 'Racecheck' at the bottom of each race a horse runs in which shows how many have won in the next 2 races, placed in the next 2 races and unplaced - therefore, do you have to have seen the race or just use this as a pointer? Also, if it was a 20 runner race and the 1st 5 have come out and won again, do you look at the 6th, 7th, 8th, etc and back them next time, or would you need to look at the race and see how the 6th, 7th, 8th, ran before picking it out?
So many questions I know!!!!
JDF |
JD,
Thats an interesting question as I have always looked at the form from certain races which does seem to work out sometimes but I read a book (by Nick morden I think) and it looks at where the pace is going to come from in certain races. As if your horse is drawn near the pace you will have more of a chance in winning, just wondered if anyone else looks at that side of things? This may be of a pointer to the shorter races though.
Saint
|
|
|
